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Walmart Makes Third Attempt with Florissant Planning and Zoning

Commissioners heard and rattled off questions about the possible new development for the town.

The commission spent two hours on Monday night—including a 20-minute closed door executive session with and Building Commissioner Philip Lum—for a lone agenda item: .

Commissioners listened to a presentation by Jeff Otto, project developer for THF Realty, and pressed him and his team on a number of questions for the development that would be placed at 3350 and 3400 N. Highway 67 as well as 3605 Seville Dr.

“The commission identified some concerns that we hadn’t thought about,” Otto said on Tuesday afternoon. “I didn’t expect approval in the first meeting.”

Otto presented plans for a 150,000-square-foot Walmart facility that would be placed to the south of Lindbergh and to the east of where currently sits on that road. The area would be developed for a 24-hour Walmart Supercenter with an out lot for a sit-down/carryout restaurant.

One by one, commissioners questioned Otto on a number of things surrounding the large development, and he or one of his team members attempted to answer as thoroughly as possible.

Several commissioners asked Otto about the brick on the building, and Otto responded that 51 percent of the building would be brick. Florissant’s ordinance states that businesses must be 100 percent masonry.

“If you want to be in Florissant bad enough, you will stick to the code,” Commissioner Jane Boyle said.

The biggest concern expressed by a number of commissioners was for residents. The new commercial development would back up close to residential areas, such as that of Barcelona Street, Aqueduct Drive and Parc Chateau Lane.

“Being a resident next to there is not ideal,” Boyle said.

Commissioner Lee Baranowski agreed with Boyle’s statement.

“I’m disturbed about the impact on the neighbors,” he said.

Baranowski pointed out that some residents could be in their backyard and would see over the property line into Walmart’s lot.

Otto said that their plan is to place a 6-foot vinyl fence up as well as a 15-foot buffer to serve as a border to the commercial business and the residential area, as Walmart would sit a lower elevation than the residential community.

Another concerning point for commissioners was the addition of a traffic signal on Lindbergh Boulevard for the Walmart.

Traffic engineer and traffic study pointperson Shawn White said that the signal would prove vital for those entering and exiting the Walmart. In addition, she pointed out that the additional traffic flow during a peak period on Saturday would be approximately 350 cars entering and exiting the roadway.

The controversial topic also brought in 10 Florissant residents to the normally sparsely attended meeting.

“I think it will destroy Florissant,” said Nancy Reilly, a resident, shop steward and employee of Dierbergs. “There’s too many ifs, ands or buts surrounding it.”

Reilly also said that she believes the new development would put and , which would be located across the street from Walmart, out of business.

Otto requested the commission postpone its vote until the Oct. 3 meeting to allow time to address some of its concerns such as the masonry, the height of the light fixtures and possible traffic problems.

Otto said that he and his teams are in the process of preparing for the next meeting and hopes that they’ll be able to adequately address concerns and questions from the commission.

In February, the commission recommended approval for one proposal of Walmart’s and recommended denial for the other item.

Previously, the city council unanimously voted down a proposal for a Walmart in the same area, however, that project requested a Tax Increment Financing for the project. The current proposal does not involve a TIF.

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Jackie Johnson September 20, 2011 at 09:58 pm
Stick to your guns Florissant. Say "NO" to Walmart...Protect your community.
R. Schuster September 21, 2011 at 02:09 am
If we needed or wanted a Wal-mart we would have let them build years ago. This may only be their second try for this location, but they have been pestering the residents of Florissant to try and get one built in one location or another for all of my 29 years. Please hold the line and vote NO on Wal-Mart, it will save many existing business and prevent a serious drop in property values!
Matt Sanders September 21, 2011 at 04:07 am
I think a walmart would do good for the city.... It would exceed tax revenues for the city and county and and create the one thing we need JOBS... Walmart has held the line on prices for electronics food and all the good things.... I think as long as they are not asking for TIFS It is a good move for the city's planning and zoning committee to go ahead with this... how would this feel if a walmart is getting built this would bring in revenue at the restaurants for their lunches and exceed revenue. I thing this is a great move for the city to go with.... they wanted to build at NEW HALLS FERRY AND VAILE AND FAILED.... i WOULD HAVE NOT BUILT ONE ON FARMLAND AT ALL. LINDBERGH IS A GREAT location to build it. I have looked at the internet and a walmart and a kmart have been a 3/4 mile from each other...I do not think this will kill kmart and shop n save... what happened if you have the midnight munchie cravings then there is a 24 hr walmart to go to... this would help the economy rises if this project happens.. one way or another a walmart still will go in even if the city says "no" they will find another way around it.
Rick Lester September 21, 2011 at 07:40 am
What affect does this have on the Lindbergh Business Center and all of the small businesses that are located on that property? Rumor has it that the center will be sold and the buildings torn down and all of the small business owners will be forced to relocate. Is this true or not?
M Hess September 21, 2011 at 10:48 am
Wal-mart does not tell Planning committies about the crime that follows their stores. A car gets stolen off the Ferguson lot daily from Thanksgiving to Christmas. I used to work there, the neighborhood gets very rough. A gun was taken off a customer in my Sam's club. Any money made in sales tax collection would go for police. SAY NO TO THIS FLORISSANT. I haven't left Florissant like everyone else because I love my town and neighborhood.
sharon Schiller September 21, 2011 at 01:27 pm
Florissant say NO to Walmart. You have K-mart and Shop and Save across the street. Walgreens a block away. Schnucks and Target right up the road and you think we need a Walmart. What about all of the small businesses that have been in that center for years? Those businesses have been in Florissant for years and years. What about some loyalty to them? Small business needs to be protected. Mininum wage jobs that Walmart produces is not going to put people back on their feet. Just say NO WALMART. All do is steal revenue from another competitor so you are not making any additonal tax revenue. So NO Florissant.
Chris Martinez September 21, 2011 at 01:54 pm
*Wal Mart may not be currently asking for a TIF but know that they will not come in as equal partners with any municipality. So what tax abatements are they seeking? Be sure they are great for them and death for Florissant. Can someone share the actual proposal?
*The jobs it creates are ineffectual for the greater good. *Kmart needs to clean up their property. Maybe in light of this vote they would be willing to do so. *Whether they build with masonry or not is the smallest of our worries. Vote NO until Wal Mart is ready to be a genuine citizen.
Blazerboy September 21, 2011 at 04:28 pm
What double standards: Save-A-Lot and KMart aren't built with brick, rather concrete block. And when did our national or state Constitutions prohibit freedom of commerce because a business does not supply 'union' jobs? And what about those small businesses in the hard-to-access strip center, who will be given incentives to relocate? Will they stay loyal to Florissant and rent in one of many empty commercial spaces in the area? I don't see Chesterfield Valley complaining of new businesses, nor the whole St.Charles area, nor the West County Center, nor the Galleria district. Those citizens just take the tax revenue and make their communities better with improved roads and schools. Quit goose-stepping to the union thug hierarchy and get a spine! Florissant needs tax revenue and growth. A city that is not growing is in fact declining.
Mark Loehrer September 23, 2011 at 02:23 am
7.25$ an hour doesn't support a family of four. It may work for kids in high school, but outside of that, you cannot raise a community on a Mall-mart, nor can you really say that it's something special given the fact that one is located down the road in Bridgeton/St. Ann.
R. Schuster September 24, 2011 at 03:01 am
Let's not forget that there is a newly expanded and renovated Wal-Mart just down the road on West Florissant in Ferguson. I wonder how much a new location that will no doubtedly be touted as "bigger and better" will scavenge revenues from that location? Could a new location possibly lead to the shuttering of that location and leave that as empty as many of the small businesses that currently surround the area where they want to build this one? And who's to say that a few years from now they don't decide that they "NEED" a new location just down the road in Hazelwood or Black Jack? But at least I can still count on Hazelwood to look out for the greater good instead of who can most heavily line their pockets as they've been saying for 20 years or better "No Wal-mart in this community, EVER!"
diane September 26, 2011 at 02:20 am
Blazerboy, who are you? Your comments about "union thugs" tell me that you have no idea what unions have done for you, and for everyone.. If it weren't for unions, we would still be under the "sweat shop hierarchy", with no medical benefits, vacation or sick days or decent wages. Walmart typically has closed most small businesses in their surrounding area,, offered poor medical benefits, paid low wages and discriminated against women. Who needs them. If you presently have the luxury of benefits in your job, thank a union. They fought for everyone.
David October 3, 2011 at 07:24 pm
If Walmart wants in the area so bad, they should build on the Jamestown Mall site.
Elizabeth O'Fallon October 5, 2011 at 04:36 pm
As a former candidate for council, I was asked by several citizens "How can we get a Walmart in Florissant?" I believe there is enough support from "the people" for a Walmart. Whether or not the union-controlled "powers that be" will allow it though is still to be seen. I seriously doubt Walmart will get the approval to build, if it's not the masonry requirement, it will be something else.
Jenoa Olson October 22, 2011 at 01:58 am
I do not agree that it will provide jobs, it will only steal the business and jobs from the businesses already there. The residents don't have any "extra" money. If I have $100 I am going to buy things at K-Mart OR Wal-Mart. Creating a new shopping venue doesn't create more money in my wallet.
Elizabeth O'Fallon October 22, 2011 at 04:06 pm
Of course it will provide jobs--for the employees that work there! Also instead of driving to St. Charles or St. Peters, the Florissant residents that currently shop at Walmart will now shop locally. This will keep tax revenues in Florissant instead of watching that money go to other municipalities.
tricia November 15, 2011 at 01:13 am
I don't shop at the Wal-Marts that are near Florissant. I feel that the areas in which both are located have gone down and crime has gone up. Strange how since the new mayor is in office how this has cropped up again, I thought we had decided against Wal-Mart.
Matt Sanders November 15, 2011 at 01:54 am
no the tax increment financing was killed but not the project. no tif is involved in this proposal
Elizabeth O'Fallon November 15, 2011 at 01:45 pm
Tricia, I'd really like to see some hard data on your "Walmart's moving into an area, crimes multiply exponentially argument." Both the Florissant's City Council and the Planning and Zoning Commission are very tough on businesses hoping to moving into the area. They do this to ensure our ordinances are met, make sure property values as well as the integrity of the area is upheld. If you doubt this, attend a City Council meeting where Walmart is involved. The meeting last night included almost 2 hours of going over specifics just in regards to the building plan and layout. There will be future meetings on the issue, so I'd encourage any of those who feel strongly on the issue of Walmart to attend them.
Maria Jansen November 16, 2011 at 12:00 pm
But now the whole CID thing is proposed. Sounds like the new TIF. Anyone care to elaborate on the differences (in the bottom line)?
Matt Sanders November 16, 2011 at 03:25 pm
A Community Improvement District (CID) may be either a political subdivision or a not-for-profit corporation. CID’s are organized for the purpose of financing a wide range of public-use facilities and establishing and managing policies and public services relative to the needs of the district. THF Florissant is proposing a 1% tax
A CID may finance new facilities or improvements to existing facilities that are for the use of the public. Such public-use facilities include: Convention centers, arenas, meeting facilities, pedestrian or shopping malls and plazas Paintings, murals, fountains or kiosks Parks, lawns, gardens, trees or other landscapes Streetscapes, lighting, benches, marquees, awnings, canopies, trash receptacles, walls Lakes, dams and waterways Sidewalks, streets, alleyways, bridges, ramps, tunnels, traffic signs and signals utilities, drainage works, water, storm and sewer systems and other site improvements Parking lots, garages Child care facilities and any other useful, necessary or desired improvement per the Missouri department of economic development. Tax increment financing is a set sales tax by the developer plus incentives for creating jobs and adding jobs. THE CID does not do that. it only goes to the development only and not jobs.
J Carney November 16, 2011 at 03:57 pm
The opposition will always cry that Walmart will bring in crime. That area already has its share of criminal activity. The Mobil station on the corner of Flower Valley's site has been held up so many times that the once 24 hour station closes at midnight. The financial institution in Flower Valley next to Kmart was held up at gun point, customers at Shop N' Save had cars stolen and had personal assaults and robberies on their lot. Schnucks at Cross Keys have had assaults and robberies as well as a car jacking incident that then mayor Lowery tried to play down. People the crime is in that area. Walmart has security patrolling is more than I can say about Cross Keys and Flower Valley. The current mayor brags about his support of the police but all he's done is promote a few officers from the friends and family plan. What has he done to improve protection of the residents? You will never see the crime reports as they actually happen in this city. They think not publicizing the crime and the criminals will make it all go away. Instead its making the long time residents go away. So tricia, get the crime reports in that area for the past 12 months and it'll make your head spin.
Elizabeth O'Fallon November 16, 2011 at 10:09 pm
Thanks for the clarification Matt. I'm wondering if Walmart is asking for the CID because of the underground drainage system they're putting in? The development proposed on Monday night includes room for another restaurant or shopping facility as well. A traffic signal would also be added to the entrance into the parking lot. I still don't like the idea of a CID being used, but I look forward to the public hearing regarding their CID application. I'd encourage anyone for or against the development to attend that meeting when it occurs.
Anthony J. Lococo February 17, 2012 at 02:45 am
Living down the road from the proposed location, my concern is with traffic flow. However, I'm in favor of the Walmart expansion and I also would encourage Florissant to annex properties near Old Halls Ferry and Lindbergh. Unincorporated St. Louis County has little to offer to senior's.
Brianna Thomas September 26, 2012 at 09:10 pm
IM ALL FOR IT !!! MORE JOBS FOR THE UNEMPLOYED AND RELIEVES STRESS OFF THE WEST FLORISSANT LOCATION WITHOUT HAVING TO DRIVE ALL THE WAY TO THE ROCK RD
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Tammy Presley Barge June 14, 2013 at 11:50 pm
Sherman was seen at the intersection of New Halls Ferry and Shackelford road on Tuesday. He isRead More still missing, but we are looking everywhere we can think of. Thanks for getting the word out.
Cindy Hynes June 7, 2013 at 12:20 pm
Call City Hall, They will come get all the limbs.
Paul Pratte June 7, 2013 at 02:56 pm
Cindy, My (93 old) mom lives in the Walnut grove neighborhood and just got her phone back yesterday.Read More Florissant told her they would NOT come by. There are several neighbors with mounds of limbs on Milbank and Wadsworth. This has to be an error. Can you followup on this?
Cindy Hynes June 14, 2013 at 02:46 pm
Paul I am sorry I just got the message, If you did not get your problem solve, call City Hall again,Read More Because I was told you would be put on a list for limbs being pick up, Call 921-5700, let them know what your mom has.